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Gym Defense Meta

It is my opinion, as a game designer and consultant, that the Gym Meta is fundamentally broken. Understand that when I say that the meta is broken, I'm not talking about the power level of specific Pokemon. I say it's broken because it doesn't accomplish the goal it set. The way that gym defense is set up, it doesn't fit well into the player's ideals of overtaking and maintaining gym control. The system we currently have is O.K., but it's not great. There's great ideas that need refinement or finishing. There's potential for more. When I initially wrote this post, I had paragraphs explaining my case. I decided that the post was too long, and have grossly oversimplified it.

There are three reasons to take a gym and hold it for an extended period of time: to earn your daily coins, to gain more balls from a raid, and for fun. Most of the player base is casual, not needing coins or extra balls. Competition for gyms is low, so gym defense defaults to one team holding it overnight while another takes it in the morning. With this rotation established, players don't need to invest into proper defenders beyond a single Blissey. In all but the most competitive zones, earning coins can be done with your lowest CP pokemon. This is not the case for every gym, and is especially untrue in dense cities, but it is the case for most of the playerbase.

This system is not fun. It turns gym control into a daily task that requires no thinking or finesse. It's not the way you tackled gyms in the main series games, and it's not what players wanted from the game. We already have daily catch, daily pokestop, daily raid, and daily research, do we really need another daily quest? Pokemon GO doesn't need the gym system to entice players to play, players already like the game.

So what would make it fun? What would make the gym system more entertaining or exciting? What would make the system more competitive for otherwise low-traffic gyms? I think I know the answer, and I'll explain it in detail.

For me, the fun of taking and holding gyms is the metagame. Each Pokemon has a type that describes their strengths and weaknesses. Furthermore, some Pokemon learn moves outside their typing. This creates many permutations of optimal lineups. Once your gym has a Blissey, which pokemon fill the other 5 slots? As an attacker, the fun is analyzing the lineup and determining the most efficient way to dismantle the defense. There are no shortage of generalist attackers, but maybe the lineup calls for some off-color specialists.

My idea is simple: increase the rewards for holding a gym, and optimize the timing for convenience.

#1: Coin Collection occurs every day at 4am. Regardless of your Pokemon occupying the gym, coins are dished out automatically. You earn 1 Coin for every 10 minutes per Pokemon that occupied a gym that day. I think 4am is optimal, to ensure players are not giving up sleep just to have a shot at in-game currency. By automatically dispensing the coins, players do not have to wait for someone else to knock them out.

#2: Players earn items for defending gyms. These can be as simple as normal Pokestop items, to rarer items like Rare Candies, TMs, and Incubators, or even cosmetics. These are also dispensed at the end of the day.

#3: Players are rewarded for taking control of a gym. If you take down a gym that you have been to before, you will only earn this reward once per day. If the gym is new to you, then you may earn the same reward again. Again, these rewards can be in the form of items, stardust, or cosmetics.

All in all, the goal is to encourage players to get excited about holding gyms. The general idea is to encourage long-term gym defense, exploration, and interaction. I think this is the system most players had in mind when the game was released. I think this is the system players would prefer.

Asked by Kelenestus6 years 2 months ago
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Answers

Hi Kelenestus,

Good premise, especially in describing how gyms operated in the base games and that this should be expected to translate into the mobile game.

I'm not sure I agree with your solutions. In the base games, gyms were about strategy and *beating them* (not holding them). It is here that I think we should start earning coins. Basically, you get 1 coin per mon you knock out of a gym up to a limit of 50 coins per day. This incentivizes people to attack gyms in rural areas, while also discouraging players from obnoxiously defending gyms via GRB's for hours on end in big cities.

The other rewards attached to gym ownership (increased yield from spinning and bonus raid balls) can stay, as the raid ball bonus in particular is the deciding factor that causes most players to actually put in the effort to flip a gym.

This helps shift the focus of gyms away from gym defense, and back onto gym sieging (where it was in the main games).

Admittedly there are some flaws in my solution as well. For example, if you only earn coins from attacking, there is little incentive to actually defend. In fact, mons like Weedle and Shedinja become fantastic "defenders" because they get the gym flipped quickly so you can attack it again.

Neither of ours are perfect solutions, but I think both are improvements over the GRBlissey meta we are currently faced with.

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I like your ideas. I definitely agree that gyms should be about sieging, and less about idle defense.

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So many things wrong I simply don’t even know were to start...

Most of the players live in cities, because umm most people live in cities

Niantic is GASP a business!!!! Businesses need to make money Double GASP.... Niantic makes money how?!? Buy selling in game currency sooo the easier it is to get coins and rare in game items the less MONEY Niantic makes...

As far as your idea of unlimited rewards for placing Pokémon in gyms you haven’t been in before... the spoofing community is completely down with that!!!!

Seriously you want to incentivize gym defense further?!?! Easily the number complaint of just about every single trainer is just how difficult it is to kick out a motivated defender and you want to give multi accounters and spoofers 144 coins PLUS items for doing what the are doing now for 50 coins?

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Kicking out fully motivated defenders is easy.

Kicking out constantly GRBed defenders, on the other hand, is ridiculously impossible.

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The condescension is strong with this one...

Seriously though, if a spoofer is dumb enough to go around the world in 2 days hitting up every gym ever for rewards, Niantic could just use that kind of feature as bait to send spoofer accounts to the shadow realm. My point: you can't code around keeping the hackers down, so why not incentivize them to be idiots and reveal themselves?

For the record: Single account single phone user who has never spoofed.

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I don't think you actually understand how business works. Nor do you understand context clues.

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by zap 6 years 2 months ago

Here's my ideas I posted a bit ago.
Much different.

https://pokemongo.gamepress.gg/q-a/people-missing-point-about-blisseygym

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