...as meta-defining as Machamp, Blissey, Tyranitar and Dragonite?
Mamoswine, yes. Partly because Ice is so weak.
Rhyperior, maybe. Ground is also weak, until Groudon gets Precipice Blades. So Rhyperior could compete with Groudon, but neither is as relevant in the meta as Machamp, Blissey, or Tyranitar. On the flip side, a stronger Ground move wouldn't break the meta. Giving Mewtwo Futuresight or a good Psyblast would, giving Blissey a fairy typing probably would, or giving Machamp better Base Values (the things IVs are added to) would.
Not sure about either of them. Rhyperior with Drill Run (Absolute best case scenario) doesn’t outperform Groudon anywhere except VS Fire, where Smack Down takes the DPS trophy, and the resistance to Fire brings TDO to an already well rounded Pokémon. And there are quite a few names that are weak to ground, the most notable being Heatran (Who will rule Fire types until Blaziken gets Blast Burn) and the Dragon slayer Dialga. Mamoswine will be THE best Ice type, but Snowy weather is pretty uncommon in lots of places, (people don’t raid in heavy snow either) and other types outclass it. (Rampardos will rule Flying, Heatran and Moltres will take Grass, Kyogre and the Hydro Cannon starters have Ground, (plus the soon to come Palkia) Still, it would be solid, probably an A-B Tier attacker. Rhyperior will probably be a B, with Groudon. However, they may be raised in the event of those bosses. But it’s impossible to know. Maybe Niantic will give Rhyperior the Rhydon situation but backwards, a Rock type fast move and charge, and no ground fast move! Maybe Mamoswine will be robbed of Avalanche and be outclassed by Weavile and Glaceon. Who knows?
Thatis somewhat the beauty of gen iv's evolutions, there so many possibilities, that at least one of them has to be good.
I do think that niantic has somewhat been holding back on these pokemon, because of the evolutions. If they were amazingly powerful as a second stage, then how much further would they go with their evolutions.
That and niantic does seem to be making each generation improve previous pokemon, while not putting others out of use completely, we could be looking at a vaporeon/gyarados situation
I fully think they will be, Ground and ice are two department ruled over by legendaries, articuno and groudon , and mamoswine will have the ability to do both very well even if it gets bad moves because of its great stats and ease of getting
Rhyperior will undoubtedly be a powerhouse, it has Rock wrecker which if given to it, and preforms similarly to the starters exclusives (which is what it is in the main series) can challenge tyranitar for the rock throne if given a rock fast move. And much like mamoswine, even if given crap ground moves, will still be a heavy hitter because of its just gargantuan stats.
Dragonite I agree is the meta defining king, like tyranitar It is bulky, reliable and does a heck of a lot of damage, it isnt easily bodied out in gyms with the exception of one pokemon, Gardevoir, but thats about it, and gardevoir isnt used too often on defense from what ive seen, now that Kirlia's a raid boss, it doesnt need to be put into gyms to try to get candy, and its frailty never really warded machamp off. Dragonite's reliability in the face of neutral match ups earned it a spot in most players teams, and hopefully, even with the superior garchomp coming soon, it wont be retired for a better alternative
MAchamp I wouldn't say is meta defining per say, as Tyranitar with smack down outputs massive neutral DPS that, with the frequent partly cloudy weather boost, can rival and in some cases machamp, as well achamps use is integrally linked with the uber tank normal, as a lot of people are starting to use fighting resistant pokemon and not just loading the full normal uber tank gym. Togekiss is in the next gen, and will be a much tankier gardevoir that has the same level of fighting resistance, and judging by the number of players on here that have commented this, a good number of people are already getting their togepi ready for this. Everyone where I live has 4+ snorlax and/or slaking, and they almost never use them because machamp cuts through them like butter, so without them, machamps use falls to just blissey which, in my experience, tyranitar and mewtwo can deal with just as easily if not more so And yes, machamp does match tyranitar and most other tier 4's, and tyranitar, and absol are both long time tier 4;s that will likely remain there for a long time, so machamp still has tht use, as well as matching a few legendaries in the future, but mostly it seems it will be used to get dark types to counter Mewtwo and giratina as well as farm tyranitar candy from raids.
I read what you wrote but I saw nothing to argue your case that Machamp isn't meta defining. The fact that people put Machamp deterrents in the gyms says everything. People wouldn't go out of their way to counter something that wasn't meta defining.
And I really don't get why you'd bring up SD Tyranitar as B Tyranitar deals better neutral damage and both variants are inferior to Machamp in neutral damage by a fair bit.
"... both variants (of Ttar) are inferior to Machamp in neutral damage by a fair bit."
Yes. People forget that Ttar coasts by on it's great stats, but Crunch and Stone Edge aren't super powerful attacks. Stone edge hits fast, and will be a beast in PvP, but for raids and gym offense, it's pretty weak. While Crunch is a three bar move, it is also pretty slow, so to get off all three of those attacks takes almost twice the time of a single Solar Beam (which is itself very slow).
