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Frost Breath vs. Ice Shard with Lapras

Why Frost Breath is so much better when attacking with Lapras than Ice Shard? DPS is only slightly better and EPS is the same?

Lapras is so rare where I live that I can't power up both my Laprasses (In fact, at the moment I can't any of these). Thus, I want to know if Ice Shard could be used when attacking or should I choose between defencing and attacking one. Both also have Blizzard

Asked by Horkkaleuka8 years 7 months ago
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Ofc Ice shard can be used in attacking. And another note, you should only power up defending pokemons untill you have 10 top defenders Maxed to atleast lv30. Because when you attacking you can choose your type and use skills to fight much stronger opponent but when you are defending its all about skill set, IV and level (or cp). So power up defenders for sure and they can also be used as attacker since they are maxed first.

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Usually, I conquer one gym per day and collect the prize right away. In addition, red team is not so strong here so you can't keep the gym for long. Thus, my primary goal is to have 6-10 strong (different species) attacker to counquer gyms and maybe if dueling will come.

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Frost Breath is just quicker and has a less "clunky" feel on attack. My good Lapras has Ice Shard and I use her mostly for defending. I find my Frost Breath Cloyster does a perfectly good job as a dragon-slayer. However, Ice Shard is perfectly serviceable on attack, especially as Lapras has the "tankiness" to suck up a few attacks without dodging. So basically, do what you want! :-)

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Against many defenders, you can fire off 2 frost breaths for 1 ice shard (less cool down/faster move) so you generate twice the amount of energy and hit 2 times...(so 18 vs 15 damage...) More energy means you will use your blizzard twice as fast and means you end up doing more damage.

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Both DPS and EPS consider the duration of moves. So based on these numbers in this site, in 10 second attacking, FB generates 138,9 damage and 86,4 energy and IS generates 133,9 damage and 85,7 energy. For me it sounds quite irrelevant which quick attack Lapras has.

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True, I suppose most likely with dodging, you won't be able to generate as much energy with Ice Shard vs Breath since it's not possible to fit 2 shards in most defenders...(more dead/waiting time).

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That's good point. Currently, I don't dodge quick moves. But maybe if dueling will come at some point, I will.

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Against Dragonite with SW you can get three FB and 2 IS. Against Dragonite with DB you can do 2 and 1 respectively. Also between charge moves you will be able to get off additional attacks more often with successful dodging with FB.
You can most likely power up one Lapras and only one if and when you get it. Decide wisely.

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Power up the Ice Shard one and slap it in a gym. Over all, both Lapras are both excellent attackers and defenders and the difference between them is relatively pedantic.

I'd like to add that Lapras's main use as an attacker is to beat Dragonite more easily. Mathematically, Cloyster with Frost Breath + Blizzard does Lapras's job better than Lapras (beats dragonite just as fast and takes significantly less damage). You should consider using your Lapras's primarily as a defenders and seek out a Cloyster as your Dragon Slayer.

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Yes, Lapras is mostly used against Dragonite. Cloyster is a good choice when there is only one Dragonite at the gym. But when there are for exemple three of them, Lapras' higher hp makes significant difference does it?

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Cloyster loses ~20% more of it's max hp, but Lapras loses ~40% more total hp (iirc). So cloyster will tank less hits than Lapras, but requires less potions to top off. I think 3 Cloysters can survive as much as 2 Lapras if you're going for the long run. Despite these small differences on attack, Lapras is roughly 1.55x better of a defender than everything but Snorlax so I always put mine in gyms, leaving Cloyster as my only Dragonite specific attacker.

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Yes I know Lapras is the second best defender. But as I said earlier, with my team (red) gyms do not stand so it is not so relevant which pokemon I choose to defend.

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If you're dodging with a FB/B Cloyster it's a pretty solid choice. It has the same base attack as Lapras with the biggest deviation being the stamina and defense differences. I personally prefer FB/B Lapras to FB/B Cloyster but sometimes my only Lapras will be defending a gym.

IMO my 2.1k CP Cloyster with FB/B makes for a fine dragon slayer but certainly isn't a replacement for Lapras. Cloyster also has the highest defense in-game and as Ryan mentioned, is easier on your potions.

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The huge drawback with Ice Shard is that it has a 1.40 second cool down whereas Frost Breath has a 0.81 second cool down. It's similar to comparing something like Razor Leaf to Vine Whip. Razor Leaf is 1.45 seconds to cool down and Vine Whip is 0.65 seconds. That's one of the reasons Tangela and Venusaur (they both can learn vine whip) are higher on the attacker tier list over Victreebel (can only learn Razor Leaf or Acid) despite Victreebel having a higher base attack. Whats more, Victreebel is a glass canon with such low defense/stamina but i'm getting off track.

So in short, Frost Breath is far less wonky, allows for easier dodging and leaves room for more error in general. Ice Shard is good for defenders because it's more efficient with AI mechanics. Regardless, both movesets are viable for attacking but one has a few more advantages.

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Frost Breath is great for "spam" attacking, click the screen as fast as you can until your finger hurts. For Ice Shard, you need to be a little more thoughtful since it is slower, especially as your opponent starts using charge moves.

As everybody said, IS can be used for both attack and defense. I tend to favor Lapras as a defender first and foremost given other Ice options for attacking.

If you are set on using your Lapras for attacking, since you have both IS and FB, have you tried them both in gym battle to see which one you prefer? Stat differences are negligible but the difference in the move cooldowns can really affect your playing style.

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I need to go to test them. IS Lapras is 1988 (71% 15/9/8) and FB Lapras is 1862 (82% 11/13/13). So there is slight difference with CP to affect this test.

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https://pokemongo.gamepress.gg/cpcalc#/

Because attack is weighted for CP calculation, when you get them up to the same level, the CP of the 71% with 15atk IV will actually be a few points higher.

Lapras has really high base stamina, so the difference in stamina IVs is not as important. At Lv30, the 71% will have 196HP and the 82% will have 199HP.

The Frost Breath Lapras is at a CP that can be usable against a high Dragonite, and maybe half way through a second depending on how well you dodge. If you power it up, then it can eat through two Dragonites easily.

The Ice Shard Lapras can still work on attack, but the dodging is tighter. Against Steel Wing, I can sometimes sneak off two Ice Shards in between two dodges, but other times I miss the dodge. If you power it up and you can organize with other team members in your area, then this could be a good gym defender.

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