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One bar charge moves

I think the DEVs are overestimating the power of one charge moves. They are ridiculously weak and easy to counter despite being the STAPLE moves of the pokemon series.

Wild Charge is stronger than Thunder. Avalance or Ice Beam are stronger than Blizzard. Heavy Slam is stronger than Flash Cannon. Drill Run is better than Earthquake. Grass Knot is better than Solar Beam. Dynamic Punch is stronger than Close Combat or Focus Blast. And for currently they like to replace the useful 2 bar moves with useless options (Such as Lapras' ice beam replaced with SURF), making one bar stab the only thing going on them. The only thing that saves earthquake and solar beam from being strictly worse is that the pokemon who learnt drill run and grass knot are garbage.

Most of them are not especially powerful and they like to stuff these moves onto random pokemon and think it will make those any pokemon stronger but in fact make them jokes, like say on Salamence or Aggron. The only good ones are Stone Edge and Future sight as far as things count.

If the STAPLE MOVES OF THE ENTIRE FRANCHISE become jokes, you know your game is out of balance.

Asked by Mr-ex7777 years 2 months ago
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Answers

Fire - Overheat
Water - Hydropump
Grass - Solarbeam
Psychic - Future Sight
Rock - Stone Edge

To a lesser extent
Normal - Hyperbeam (BS is not relevant atm)
Poison - Gunk Shot
Ground - Earthquake

There are a lot of one bar moves which are pretty good/best of their type...

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Many of those moves aren't actually the best of their type.
Water - Surf
Grass - Grass Knot/Power Whip/Leaf Blade
Rock - Rock Slide

Poison - Sludge Bomb
Ground - Drill Run

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Then it's because the guys who learnt grass knot, power whip and drill run are garbage. Anyway if you managed to screw up most if not all of the staple moves in the pokemon franchise, you did a horrible job.

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Gyarasos, Vaporeon and Kyogre don't learn Surf, so as I see it this move is not relevant in the meta. If you want to attack with a surf pickachu feel free^^ Maybe that's how Niantic wants/trys to balance the game...same goes for grass...Victrebeel with Leaf Blade is not really a part of the meta. Exeggutor does the Job with Solarbeam. Rhydon and Groudon learn EQ not Drill Run... Rock Slide is not really the better move on Golem. It has advantages for dodging but dps wise SE is better. Muk is probably the best Poison Type with Gunk Shot but yes, Victrebeel and Gengar give him a run with Sludge Bomb. The point I wanted to make is that there are a lot of good 1 bar moves in the game too.

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Many of the moves being discussed are frequent weather boost candidates; esp stone edge and earthquake. I personally don't dodge, if you do, you might like 1 bar moves

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Last 3 legendary ho-oh , groudon and kyogre has only 1 bar moves..think if they have 2 or 3 bar move they will destroy any gym and not a single pokemon can hold his place for even few mjnites.. it's good that we dont have that much multibar moves.. otherwise gym defence would be nothing to compare..

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Gym defence is already meaningless. Multi bar moves just make sweeping low motivation gyms slightly quicker.

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I wholeheartedly agree. Two-bar moves should not be the best DPS of many types, often with a significant difference too. The basic principle should be that less bars gets you better DPS, while more bars offers less DPS in optimal situations but carries less risk of wasting energy. Overheat and Flamethrower are my favorite example because they're balanced very well in relation to each other.
I don't think it would be that hard to balance the existing moves either, it's just tweaking numbers without major changes in the code and the tweaks can be figured out in an afternoon with a spreadsheet.

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by Oscarv 7 years 2 months ago

On defense, 1-bar charge moves also lost value. There were times when you were level 25 and your attackers got knocked out by something like Stone Edge. At level 32+ with powered up attackers plus enhanced type effectiveness bonus (1.4x instead of 1.25) you can get most ones down before any 1-bar move, usually coming when dropping dead. If you do take a hit, you often survive.

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Few cases where this does not apply:

Futuresight > Psybeam/Mirror Coat/Psyshock
Overheat>Flamethrower/Fire Punch [edit]
Hyper Beam>Hyper Fang/Swift/Body Slam (For attacking)
Hydro Pump>Surf/Aqua Tail
---
Hurricane >?< Sky Attack
Draco Meteor >?< Outrage

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Outrage is better than Draco Meteor (almost the same cooldown) the detail here is that Salamence has higher attack that Dragonite, also Sky Attack is better that Hurricane (more power in two bars and less cooldown per use)

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Surf>Hydro Pump>Aqua Tail.
Sure Hydro Pump is 0.1s faster than 2 Surfs for the same amount of damage, but when we're averaging performance Surf ends up being better because it wastes much less energy.

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Future Sight > Psybeam/Psychic/Psyshock > Mirror Coat

Overheat>Flamethrower

Hyper Fang = Body Slam > Swift

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