Let's face it, raids aside, this update sucked really bad for anyone who plays this game as it should be played. Anyone who has played this game pretty much from the start has invested ALOT of time & probably afew quid aswell. Another popular game I play, Clash of Clans, was getting alot of criticism until the last couple of years when it finally began listening to the community. After implementing changes that fans had been asking for for years the game went to a different level & they continue to listen, update & improve. I feel Niantic ought to look at that & start listening to the huge fanbase Pokémon Go has built up & fulfil the huge potential it has. After the time & money many high level players have invested, I feel they have a duty to listen to the community & listen to players who know what they are talking about.
They have no duty at all. They could shut down the servers, share the money they have made and each of them could buy a house in a sunny location and live there for the rest of their life.
They did not promise anything, and those who invested money should know that this is for the moment's fun and not a longterm investment.
There's no pleasing people. We wanted a new gym system. Not good enough. We wanted to reroll moves on out high stat high level mons. Too rare. We wanted to see more rare mons. Too common. Its no wonder they say boards like this can be toxic.
The only thing generally dropped the ball on is reducing outer freebies. 50 coins a day feels dirty especially after introducing a new item for 100. If a raid pass was 50 coins it might soften the blow. But someone somewhere would doubtlessly complain about how they should get two premium passes a day.
I think this new system is hear to stay. That being said I truly hope some tweaks and improvements are made. General consensus is the final fight to kick out a rival team is boring because the motivation to CP loss is extreme. It would also be nice not to lose out on daily coins when we have one or more defenders who did their job and were not kicked out of their gym. Infact there should be an additional (small) reward any day you don't lose a gym.
But they acted like the parent that finally breaks the toy throws the toy at the kid and screams "here you go!"
Just because people are complaining doesn't mean you just give in by throwing a tempertantram and wreck the product in the process.
IMO the best example of how they handled this was like when my co-worker said "if I were in charge, I would get rid of the IRS." I said, "If you do that, who will collect the taxes?" He looked at me with a blank stare realizing he didn't think that through at all.
I feel like Niantic threw a fit, and didn't fully think their changes through. It makes me wonder if Ingress is this much of a cluster, or if they made an effort with that.
What's your take on the introduction of TMs? I think that was a great addition! I don't understand why the collect is Maxed out at 50 (hopefully just for the moment).
I also think the fact that we get coins based on only when our Pokémon return is to deter spoofing (but wasn't thought out)-just my opinion. I also think we should get coins at the end of the day for how long Pokémon have been in gyms
I see what you're saying in that they "lashed out", yet I think Fred's post also has merit. No matter how they tried to implement the new gym system, there will always be some group that is not pleased; it is impossible to please 100% of the player base. Again, like you are getting at, they could have done so in such a way to appease a greater population, but it's difficult to find a solution to combat spoofing/create a fair gym system/help newbies/help those that are on teams in areas where other teams control the gyms/etc/etc/etc
I do like the introduction of the TM. At this point I don't know if they are too rare or too common.
On the spoofers, I'm not sure how dedicated they are and how much it deters them, especially with the berry feeding thing. I will say their ability to obtain coins has been hindered.
My biggest issue is the current gym system. It is quite simple...give me a reward for taking down a gym and I will take a bunch of gyms down every day. Give me some stardust! I have no incentive to take down gyms right now, nor do I have an incentive to put a real defender.
To collect max coins right now I simply put party hat Raichu in a gym around 1 AM and I have him back by noon, for max collection. No point in putting a second Pokemon in gyms.
I think duty is the wrong word.....
But they should listen to feedback from hardcore fans... and try to keep them happy.
The do need to balance that against the needs of new players and casual players....
Getting new players is the key to the game surviving or growing long term...
I hope they take feedback on board but IMO they need to go forwards not backwards.....
So the solution is adding more new challenges and features.....
I play the game from July 2016 (almost Lev37) and I was collecting 90 or 100 coins per day for the last three months before the gym rework.
Still, I rather like the new format of the game. Old gyms were stagnated -and there are a lot of players who coulnd't collect 10 or 20 coins per day, let alone 50.
So, it is wrong to assume all hardcore players are against the new format.
The Old: Incredibly difficult to get a top mon with a top ms, this was a source of quit-worthy frustration for the average player.
The New: Top mons with solid IV's are being thrown at us everywhere we look. Shitty ms? No worries just change it.
I dunno what the definition of "Middle Ground" is, but going from one extreme to the other ain't it.
Exactly, nobody said the old system wasn't without its flaws but we put up with those flaws & played for nigh on a year so it can't have been that broken. The new system has seen many quit the game or certainly not playing as much. Most I know don't bother with the gyms now, or put in the leg work they used to, they just do afew raids. So I would say it's more broken now than it was before. Old system needed tweaking, not completely changing & undoing all our hard work. I think as customers we have a right to be pissed & express our opinions.
I just want fricken PvP man...
I could care less about the current, previous, or future gym systems. "But it affects my collect!" Cool. I want something where players can directly compete against each other, using strategy, with such a skill gap such a player, say, lv32 could destroy a lv38, if the lv32 knows the type advantages and movesets to a much greater extent.
I just want to be the very best, that no one every was. The main series allows for it! Yes, this is not the main series, but I still want to be able to play other people and crush them based on my knowledge of the Pokémon world!
I would appreciate feedback or criticism of this comment! (Constructive criticism if criticism plzz)
There are plenty of online battle simulators for Pokémon. If you want a knowledge based type of Game pogo is crap.
Try online simulators to battle trainers not using dragonites/tyranitars/legends etc. Now it is just obtaining the strong pokemons with the one or two best move sets
Pogo has 2-3 charge moves with no toxic/confused, mirror coat etc effect whatsoever. Its no knowledge/intellectual depth in it whatsoever.
I play Pokémon showdown on a daily basis, here is a "recent" example of my prediction 'skill':
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7unratedrandombattle-577194409
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-365608614
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7challengecup1v1-578185573
And CURRENTLY it requires minimal strategy, yet I know the typing multipliers like the back of hand, to the extent that I will be able to craft a well rounded team, and once PvP releases, I am more than confident I will be able to sweep any player. Those type advantages chart? Had that shit memorized when gen6 launched (and when fairy was introduced, and ghost/dark multipliers against steel were changed). This recent damage multipliers update will ad me to a greater extent. As soon as you switch out a counter, I'll predict who you'll put in once I see your team and have a counter lined up, alll day.
I am familiar with all of those aforementioned moves. Stealth rocks, sticky web, rain dance, rest/sleep talk, substitute, encore, baton pass, will-o-wisp, etc. are all favorites of mine. Oh and the protect mind games are real. I am frustrated that I cannot transfer and utilize my knowledge of showdown and the main series in Go; it irks me.
Note: I apologize for sounding confrontational. As I mentioned, I frequent Pokémon showdown and favor that hugely over Go. I want to be able to wipe anybody that I meet in real life, using my knowledge of the Pokémon universe, especially through type advantage. Do you see where I'm coming from? Yes, the gym system is important, but ts not a priority for ME. I know how to play the game particularly well in the main series, and I've learned about all (most, atleast third evolutions, ubers, OU, UU, etc) the Pokémon. From MY perspective, the lack of a direct competition feature is driving me crazy. I'm level 37 and have nearly maxed out Pokémon, with movesets that I think will benefit in PvP. It's coming, eventually (lol). And when it does, I'll be ready. It sounds like you will too. Best of luck!!
Edit: "it currently has no intellectual depth" - even though the moves require no intellect, typing does-I am prepared to outplay anyone from just having a well-rounded squad. Sure, somebody can run: Tyranitar, dragonite, Snorlax, lapras, machamp and gengar, but I will be aware of what the popular picks will be and will be prepared to be one step ahead of the meta ;)
Here's my constructive criticism...
I can care less for PvP honestly...One reason is on every raid I've been at, I start 20-30 secs later than everyone else so in that time, if I were to PvP, I'd be already knocked out...Network lag, phone issues, etc...will make PvP unplayable IMO unless they go to turn based and they never will for Pokemon 'go' (less go now with raids)...
Also, my time is already set to auto network provided time...
Also, maybe I'm an old fart, but I don't see the need to "show" random people I don't know that I'm the very best...I've been in raids with higher level people who do miniscule damage, talking about Lvl 37+ who when we did a raid, 3 people did less than 1/3 of me and my wife combined...and we don't have overpowered (30+) mons.
You can see level 36/37+ people prestige and do pitiful prestige as well. The majority of people simply don't come here or SR and don't play optimally. They just have a ton of time to grind IMO (and drive around mostly).
That said, that means if I were to PvP, it's not a matter of my skill or anything, but because either my phone provider sucks or my phone sucks...
Edit: Agree with the comment above me...If you want to show how "great" you really are, play the video games or card games and actually win REAL money and all that...PoGo is NOT a competitive or skill based game...Being great in it means zip IMO. (I used to play the TCGO and the "skill" in that was mostly using a high odds to win deck and remembering all possible combinations when you face someone else with a certain type of deck (memorization)...Night March was very hard to win against for many decks and Quaking Punch Seismitoad-EX made games very boring...Haven't played in a long while.
I frequent Pokémon showdown, which requires heavy knowledge of the game as well as wit and prediction; it would be cool to utilize my knowledge of
type advantages in Pokémon Go, whereas it sounds like PTCG requires tangible items which increase the ODDS of events happening. Granted, showdown doesn't require as much memory-related "skill", but it requires knowledge of the game, prediction, wit, and thorough thinking
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7unratedrandombattle-577194409
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-365608614
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7challengecup1v1-578185573
As well, like you said about other higher level players that grind, that creates some skill gap. I know type advantages VERY well, to the extent that I am confident I would be able to continuously put in type advantageous Pokémon throughout a match, while thinking ahead, to outplay opponents
Edit: I apologize if this sounds confrontational or salty. I am just frustrated that my knowledge of thenpokemon universe isn't transferable from showdown to here. It irks me when I meet up with people and they think they know what is the most advantageous Pokémon to use in situations. For example, SC/SB typhlosion gets a lot of hate, but when PvP is released, it will be a nasty naasstty moveset, hitting neutral on any of the Pokémon it's weak against with SC and then firing off a SE solar beam as punishment.
I agree with ironman_gaming, with the current stability or better instability of the game no one would enjoy PvP and the atmosphere of the comunity would be worse than now.
From my point of view PvP is in the far future. Right now it would add to much load on the servers and niantic has other things on their plate.
