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WTF is wrong with you people

After reading (https://pokemongo.gamepress.gg/q-a/nothing-matters-any-more), I felt so pissed off. When the F has our GP community become so toxic??

Before the gym rework, you had been asking for TMs. Ok, here you have them.
Before the gym rework, you had been asking for more variety of Pokémon. Ok, here you have it, one Pokémon per species in a gym.
Before the gym rework, you had been asking replace CP. "CP is a terrible indication of Pokémon Power", blah blah blah. Ok, here you go, CP is gone.
Before the gym rework, you had been asking about making gyms less lagging. Complaining about Blissey towers. Ok, now the turnover is high.
And most importantly, before the gym rework, you had been asking for higher rewards for beating gyms. Ok, now you have Raid, huge reward, then now you are b*tching about it??
Niantic gave us exactly what you want. So this is what it's like if what you get what you want. Boom.

The way I see it, you are complaining because you already have or are close to having every best Pokémon, but you don't want others to achieve it. When a update hurts your competitive advantage, then it's bad; otherwise, it's good.
I myself am your high-level player. L39 with a lot of hard grinding mons. Do I feel that I'm losing competitive advantage? Sure do, but so what? It's just a game and having fun is all you need to care for.

Don't focus about the end. Focus about the process. New comers would never enjoy the excitement of evolution and getting a good moveset after a lot of grinding, nor would they experience running for a Dragonite at 2am in the morning and meeting acquaintances. They would never have stories to remember when getting old. But I know for our legit players, we definitely will.

For the record, I'm not defending Niantic. I don't like this company anymore than you do. And they could have done better in many places, such as addressing the tons of bugs now in the gym. But to be fair:

They gave you what you wanted,
you just don't know what you want.

Asked by bioweapon8 years ago

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Answers

Didnt read lol.

Ok, I read the first sentence and that was enough to get what you wanna say.

Problem is that Niantic is rewarding too easily. Game is dying because the things you may want from the game, are wayyyyyyy too easy to obtain. Do you understand?

There is no reason for people to work in a longterm on anything. It is absolutely not about crying that others get what you "worked for" for free (at least not in my case). Its about killing the playerbase by rewarding them with very few time and resources invested.

Once the so beloved casuals got their things easily they will simply quit. This way the game is burning out. You can make the game competetive to everyone without burning it in weeks.

Old casuals quit, new casuals join. Or some become the new hardcore while some old hardcore quit.
Choose one.

No offense, but you really do not understand what the game change is doing.

Cheaters having 100 tyran might keep playing because they are silly to begin with. But regular people have no interest in collecting 100 tyran and keep playing.

If you feed the horse too much and too fast it is not gonna run for you anymore.

It is so simple dude. You always have to balance reward and work. Otherwise the system falls apart.

I don't know how much you spend on Raid. But I still haven't fought a Tyranitar and Snorlax in Raid yet. And even if I do, who knows I can catch them or not?
Yes, getting a good T-Rex has never been so easy before. But u need to pay for the pass. Where do u get the coins? It's your previous gym grinding paying off, man! New comers will never get enough coins to pay for the pass. So there's still some difficulty.
They should make it harder, that I'll give you. But does it ruin the game for good? Nah I don't think so. I'm willing to listen to what you will say to convince me.

Tbh I dont care convincing someone about that the game change is stupid as hell.

I "knew" around 20-30 lvl 35-40 guys around my area. None is interested anymore. Not even the casuals which showed up out of nowhere with their mid lvl 20's are going to enjoy the stagnant gyms as they are right now.

At some point they will find themselves alone. Having no grinders to look up to is gonna demotivate as well. We all need idols.

Trust me, Id love to think more positive about the change, but it is not going to last long if it stays as it is. Feels like it changed to a shortterm game.

Every day, you get a free raid pass. Resolve that you'll only use it on a L4 gym and sooner or later a T-rex will hatch. Raids are so common, happen multiple times a day.

Spend 2-3 days camping out (for maybe 30 mins) at a spot where there are several raids hatching and bingo, one of the days a L4 gym will hatch a Tyranitar or Snorlax. If it doesn't hatch either but hatches a Blastoise instead, no one is forcing you to use your Raid pass for that - save it for the next round of raid hatches.

For those who collect 50 coins per day it's even easier. A Free-to-play player can do 3 raids every 2 days.

I assure you my friend, if you use your Raid pass on L4 gyms (and L4 gyms only), before long you will be swimming in T-rexes.

This is faaaar easier than catching a Larvitar a day and building up candy the hard way (and if you did manage to catch a Larvitar a day, people here would automatically assume that you spoof.... so yes this community has never been toxin-free).

2 t-rex in the last two days but only 71 and 79 % and not enough tms
don't know whether i am proving or disproving your point.

Proving the point, because..... have you ever caught 2 T-rexes back to back, with >70% IVs?

I mean, spoofing/maphacking excluded ofc.

Spoofers already had tons of strong PMs with perfect or nearly perfect IVs, with best move sets. This update, helps legit players to catch up with the difference greatly, so that spoofers don't have that much of advantage comparing to legit players. I love this update. It's just they need to do some more balance adjustments to make it even better

I agree 100%.
And whether it is a spoofer or legitimate hard-working player with tons of Blissey, Tyranitar, Snorlaxi and Dragonites in gyms - I could never see that from the name and anyway they are just not very fun to play with/against.

I never understood why a hardworking player wanted to look exactly like a spoofer, or wait a minute, the reverse.
Now the hardworking player complains the lower level hardworking players need to work a little less hard for Pokémons - but they forget those players never had and still will not have any advantage in gyms compared to them.

If I may speak for myself as a dedicated player, I never asked for a different gym scene than we had. Spoofers and multi accounts were the issue. They now completely removed the only competative part of the game for me. Also, because it is way less rewarding than it used to be.

Further I have always been a strong disliker of TMs. I've evolved tons of Pokemon to get the very best and be better than others. I play the game to be the best with team valor, not to be of the same skill as someone who logs in once a week.

This may sound and is very egoistic, but I'm just slightly dissapointed of what happened. I'll get over it no worries.

Yes, the TMs are too much of an easy ride. And again city players who already had many more chances at the RNG for improving IV and move sets get a new super benefit compared to countryside players (as 100 coins is easily earned in 2 days and raids are abundant).

Dude I did not ask for anything.

I never asked for TMs. I think they're stupid. Yes, I have rolled many BP/HS Machamps but I sucked them up while others complained. I have also rolled my fair share of SW/HB Dragonites and IT/FB T-rexes so yes, I know the pain. But I never asked for TMs because I couldn't handle the disappointment.

I also never asked for Pokemon variety in gyms. I took down countless 10-stack Blissey gyms on my own, while others complained. [I did however ask for more potions to help me do this - but I did not ask for a fundamental change in the way gyms worked].

I did not ask for CP to be meaningless. I benefited from having high CP mons. Why would I want to devalue my own sweat and effort?

I did not ask for higher rewards for beating gyms/collecting coins. I was willing to break an actual sweat for it, I assume that others would too.

The way I see it, you are complaining because you already have or are close to having every best Pokémon, but you don't want others to achieve it. When a update hurts your competitive advantage, then it's bad; otherwise, it's good.

Not true. My lament is the total lack of challenge (and therefore, lack of fun... for me). Apparently, judging my the replies to my thread, I am not alone in having this feeling.

I myself am your high-level player. L39 with a lot of hard grinding mons. Do I feel that I'm losing competitive advantage? Sure do, but so what? It's just a game and having fun is all you need to care for.

Again, it isn't about losing competitive advantage or not wanting others to succeed. It's just that the game has, overnight, become so un-challenging that it's ridiculous.

They gave you what you wanted,
you just don't know what you want.

I would have to respectfully disagree with you there. They did roll out changes which many players wanted (but not me personally)... but my opinion is that the result leaves much to be desired.

First of all, the "you" I used didn't mean you as Conquistador, it's in plural form. The "you" is the community. Not only GP, but TSR on reddit too.
If you don't believe me, TRNTips pretty much represents what the majority of them (us) think, and my examples are in line with what he said/thought.
Second, I'm not provoking a fight either. You got your points and I got mine too. And you do make some points, I'll definitely give you that.

You know, that's the thing. I don't think many were expecting TMs to be common as they are now. Most people would have wagered that, if TMs ever came out, they would have to be strictly controlled in quantity. But look where we are - within 4 days of the raid rollout I have no more IT/FB Tyranitars to reroll.

Too easy with TMs. What's next, IVMs which increase IVs? Got a 95% Dragonite with 13ATK, please please Niantic give me a magic wand to roll it up to 15? When will it stop? Is it 'fun' for everyone to have a perfect 100% Dragonite?

If you think this is objectionable.... well look, there is no line being drawn. The principle is exactly same and surely you can agree, once we reach there it's game over.

You know what. I start to agree with you on one point:
Raid Boss shouldn't be caught at all, or should be much harder to catch.
Legendaries are exception. They can be caught, but should be 100,000CP and the limit on players should be 20 as well.
And they need to make the CPM above L30 increased much more significantly, so that the difference between high lever players are low lever players is big enough to make leveling up time-worthy.

But I'm glad with TM. I have many mons with Shitty move sets but I can't throw them away. Now they are given a second chance. I'm very happy about that, tbh.

Let me then take it one step further. Let's say, you have now successfully converted all your bad-moveset mons to great-moveset mons due to TMs. What's next, my friend? Movesets don't matter any more because:

You don't need them for gym attack/defense because the determining factor is motivation. You can now use your bad-moveset SWHB Dragonite to take down a low-motivation gym. Likewise it does not matter which moveset defender you put into a gym because they all come down anyway.
moveset is supposed to be relevant for raiding but in reality, you don't really need it because there are very few situations where, but for moveset, you fail to take down a L4 gym. Most times, you either have sufficient numbers to take down the boss or you don't. If you have numbers, you win, regardless of moveset. If you don't have the numbers in the raid lobby, you lose even if you've lined up 6x C/DP Machamps v Tyranitar. There is only a very thin slice of players who are on the fringes between success and defeat for L4 raids and it is usually level/powerups that determine the outcome (not moveset)

Remove the catch component (except for Legs, which are limited to one catch per account). Then drastically reduce the frequency of TMs.

As much as i love watching ttips is fake in a way cuz its his job so he is tryin to hype everything. You cant base your fact on him or any other youtuber.

Epic

I'm with you brother read the last reply on that thread from me. Everything they said on the thread was basically waaaaah why can't I show how much better I am to other players!?

Yes, but that's what a game is about. Who is happy to be mediocre?

Shinies, PVP and badges can be a form of comparison and competition moving forward, but I think the community needs to realize this game is intended and should probably be more about going out, exploring, meeting new people and having pleasant experiences together.

You obviously did not read the other thread at all

That is just, like, your opinion man
And I strongly disagree.

I think your thread started well (except the bad title, did not like that at all), but once I reached this sentence "Before the gym rework, you had been asking about making gyms less lagging." I stopped reading instantly, everything you say don't matter if you have the ... to say this, gyms are worst than EVER, all the bugs we had before are still there and they have created like 4 or 5 new ones lol, attacks bars moving up & down, health going up & down, a new switch bug and lag and connection errors are like 1000 times worst than before...

So yes, you are wrong, completely wrong, only thing good about this update TM's and raids, the rest is worst than before without any doubt, even raids are poorly implemented, consuming your pass before seeing the lobby, glitched mon selection and the fight itself is just a tap tap tap without any skill at all to beat the boss, just be a high number of players, quantity of people over quality, and if you live on an area with low amount of players you are screwed, in gyms and in raids, no one takes your mon out, you don't get coins, no one shows up, you can't do high tier raids, period.

What I meant by "making gym less lagging" was "making gym with higher turn-over rate". And you are absolutely right, there are just way too many bugs now.
But what if all the bugs are fixed? I thought that was what the community had pictured.

I have read both flame threads. It's just a game.

If you no longer like the game stop playing.

Lol who thumbs down that

? you! Ya schmucks

I'm level 38, tried one raid solo was glitch so no more for now. I like the changes as it sticks two fingers up to cheats!
I do not care that I have a bunch of 3000 plus useless defenders, or that I now hold one gym. Cheats out real players in what's not to like!

Spot on crazyredwind.

I'm loving how the gym update has only been out for what a week... and already players are proclaiming "DOOM" upon Niantic.

The old gym system was withering on the vine, and Niantic had to do something. And no doubt they're reading the numbers on gym turnover, boss raids, etc to fine tune the game in coming months.

As to Boss selection, I personally don't find them that outrageous. Some good egg hatches could get you most of the better ones. Because that was the way I got my first Snorlax, and mostly how I got my first Tyranitar.

Interestingly enough the most hardcore players in my area are fine with the change. Why you ask? Because they've stockpiled 12,000+ coins a piece and finally have something to blow it on. Sure the average player can either pay for an advantage or slowly do a raid a day. These guys have already done over a hundred though.

We can all agree that cutting gym coins was not cool. I personally don't like the dramatic reduction of cp the third time around in gym battles. Otherwise the new system is growing on me. Maybe that's because I picked up my first two TMs today though. That and my community of trainers are very active in the raid scene and we can easily take down anyone so far with just 4 or 5 trainers (and the occasional spoofer)

But aren't they all tracker users? That's how they got all these coins and great attackers.... right?

Unfair gameplay IMO. May they have fun, I don't see the point.

I'm the same way with the new coin cap, as it should hits the Spoofers hard with only being about to get max 350 coins instead of the old 700 a week. And that's even if it causes me to spend a few more dollars in the store.

I think the bottom line for me and many others and something you forget is that a lot of the goals or challenges in the game is completely out the window now.

I believe after raids get boring for a lot of folks, things will stagnate even more since gyms are less useful since you can't even test mons as much if you wanted to (woe to Funkysho who can't keep trying battles with his own team).

As some of the others, I never asked for 1 species limit (dumb restriction), I didn't mind CP as well since it, at least made some sense honestly and I never heard a single suggestion that was good enough to replace it. What we have now is worst, all IMO of course...

I didn't mind the Blissey towers, just nerf bubblestrat.

I also didn't mine the stagnation since as a solo player in my home area, I was able to knock down any team even though I was the minority by simply tearing it all down constantly...Leave at 20k prestige or less, repeat constantly and make sure they never collect.

Now, any gym taken over gets 6 guys instantly, no more having to work for spots...I tear it down now and can't even get 10 coins like before...I get kicked out within 30-60 minutes normally.

I also wanted TMs, but didn't mind spending the 125 candies neither so 100% mons or whatever can still be salvaged...Done 10 raids, got 6 TMs already...Eventually, everyone will have enough they can use which is OK I guess, but again, I sorta like having a challenging game (note my handle here).

I will still play since again, I've mentioned that Pokemon Go will NEVER be a competitive or strategic game...We overthink things here on GP and SR since I'd assume a lot of us are gamers so we play...

But the changes just pretty much hands out participation trophys for everyone making everything too easy, not challenging, unrewarding...

Again, all these changes were to help casuals (which I actually call myself since I don't grind (36+), but we can see what happens when the hype dies down.

Not sure what they can do to salvage it...and if it will pay off in the future...

This sounds like a post written by a person who hardly plays the game and your lv39?? Seriously?.. this update has changed it to much. Every game needs to be competitive and has some point to the end game Otherwise guess what it will die out

I do play a lot and I still do.
And does my point conflict with yours in any way?

Point is simply once we all get our army of T-rex, Snorlax (not even useful anymore), Lapras, game will slowly die...my kids all stop playing once they have caught all their new favorites...

Same will happen in this new meta...old time players already don't maintain their old areas (waste of time since you need someone to kick you out). I used to LOVE going to farther gyms where I have to hike to, but that just means I will never get kicked out there now.

There is also not much "GO"ing when walking is meaningless with rare candies (I got 37 now after 10 raids)...Hatching high IV mons are useless since most rares are in raids (tier 4)...Dust is good, but hopefully, you've been saving it for this update and have enough to cover you (I had close to a mil).

I believe after a bit, you'll feel like everyone else as there is little/no more point when you have "won" and "completed" the dex/game...

We'll see I suppose.

Right in tine for gen 3 ... This autumn/winter

People will complain no matter what. I'm with you, people are toxic with no reason since the gym rework was released.
I like the update. It was needed. Still needs some adjustments that will be eventually done for sure.
Have fun :)

I honestly think there is a difference in people being toxic and this community. Majority of the people tries to express theirselves with arguments.

I'm glad you said something because I was disappointed in every thread about how bad the update is. Yes everyone has an opinion, that's fair. But simply take the game for what it is, this update is still new. I do not believe the update is final - they can still change things around. I encourage people to do what I did - if it's not fun, take a break from the game. I took a six month break prior to gen 2 being released for similar reasons that people don't like this update. It's not like I'm supporting the entirety of this update, there are flaws, but these raids have done something that I do like, and that is to bring people together to achieve a common goal. What I value more is being able to play with my friends, who are new to the game, and meeting new people. Sure it's not the same nostalgic feeling like back then when you can go to the park and there literally would be 100 people playing, but it's something. Again this is just phone app, a game, play how you want to play, but if you truly support Pokémon in general, I wouldn't get overheated about the update. Take it as it is, offer positive suggestions, and hopefully things work out.

Totally with you on this mate. Cry me a river is so widespread here it's unbelieveable. You have a problem with TM's, rare candies and boss raid? All you need to do is... NOT F**KING PARTICIPATE. If you really don't care that other can keep up, it's that simple. But you do, oh you do so much. And that's why you're crying so hard. Guess what? In 2 days time, after my dissertation I'm gonna battle EVERY SINGLE Tyranitar raid in my city, and gonna have MORE OF THEM THAN YOU, mwahahahahahahahah!

THe problem is that the game now rewards everyone even if they didn't put in the work.

Lets take pokemon out of the topic an put in a career.

Imagine you had a job where you bust your ass for 4 years studying in college, getting your masters degree, started out as an intern in the mailroom making $12/hr then over the next 5 years worked your way up the chain to becoming an associate to start earning 6 figures yearly. But then, then one day you look in the office next yo yours an see a familiar face. Its little Timmy, hes making the same 6 figures as you and all you can recall is Timmy didn't show up to every class in college, he never studied, never did his assignments, and received an honorary degree because his parents "donated" to the school. Timmy didnt start at the bottom, and work his way up but here is side by side with you making the same salary you are with minimum effort.

That's why players are pissed. Those who worked hard to be the very best are being put side by side with those who only play the game when something new is added. These same trainers are now essentially buying rares for 100 coins a pop with no effort. I walked the hell out of my Chansey, Lavitar, Dragonair, and Snorlax for candies just to get them all over 3000CP but now my party hat 300CP Pikachu is a more viable defender? This makes no sense.

Honestly in a month or two, this raid thing will be stale for the casuals and Niantic will have a player base that is annoyed with the new system (the old timers) and the casuals are simply gone...

When gen 3 drops, casuals catch and leave again...

I honestly don't care if everyone can get a T-rex, whatever, but at the end of the day, for Niantic as a company, if there is nothing left for people to do (trust me, in a month or two, most will not not bother with level 4 raids or drive there or what not when you have 4 or 6 t-rex, quite a few TMs, etc...)). I didn't even bother catching Chanseys, Larvitars at night if they are too far on nearby since I had a ton from V-day and Larvitars spawn here.

All these "new" mons will be useless since gyms are even easier and defending is useless since most defenders want you to knock them out and don't want you to even feed berries (I've stopped feeding berries to people on my "team") that I see has been there for over 8 hours...

Again, it's Niantic's game, but these changes will come back to bite them IMO. And as I keep saying, this is a casual game so don't ever expect it to ever be that challenging or skill based...

As a free player with maxed storage, 8k+ free pokecoins before these changes, no skin off my back really with whatever they do, but they are shooting themselves in the back longer term since incubators are pretty worthless (yes, there is dust, but defenders are not needed anymore and if you catch stuff, you only need so many attackers)...and if you only did select tier 4 raids, you probably will never run out of raid passes to have to spend real money...

In my opinion, this update is here to salvage the last bit of cash that Niantic can make from this dying game. It is not here to revive PoGO.

From a business stand point, it's usually not worth it to "save" a product that is losing popularity. You want to do what you can to cash out a little more then say goodbye.

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