Tm & legacy moves
Are there any good Combinations with legacy and New moves.?
Im considering changing my machamp to karatechop and Dynamic punch
Answers
I think he has Karate Chop and something else that he wants to change to Dynamic Punch
Re OP: If your original move is Cross Chop, don't bother to change it. The merit of the KC/CC Set is the much increased viability in dodging compared to the C/DP and C/CC sets. Take that away and there isn't the advantage anymore for KC/CC (and you might as well just go for C/DP)
However if it is some other rubbish move like Stone Edge or Submission then sure go ahead.
I'd say go with the Close Combat one for now, and when that's maxed out or you think it's good enough for raids, if you wanted you could then work towards a second Machamp for Tyranitar/Snorlax raids.
Close Combat is really close in effectiveness to Dynamic Punch, so don't worry about the difference in overall DPS. Check out this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFkcX3Up1XE
It takes 80 candies to take the level 6 Machamp to level 26. Even if you do have the candies to take the DP Machamp to 26 where it would be stronger than the level 26 CC Machamp, you could instead use those 80 candies on the level 26 Machamp and take it to level 34.
And a level 34 Machamp with C/CC is definitely stronger than a level 26 Machamp with C/DP, The extra damage it could mean the difference between finshing level 4 raids or not, which gives you more chances to get another TM.
DT/DC Dragonite if it was SW before.
Rock Throw Omastar can now get rid of Hydro Pump or Ancient Power for Rock Blast if it doesn't have Rock Slide.
Maybe Wing Attack + Overheat Charizard, since Wing Attack is the only dodge-friendly quick move on Charizard.
Dragon Breath + Outrage Gyarados is a slight boost over Dragon Pulse.
Counter + Brick Break Hitmonchan
I think your example Karate Chop + Dynamic Punch is the best example of a really strong legacy + new move combination.
Karate Chop is pretty good now with it's insane energy gain but legacy Machamp is still kind of weak because none of the old charge moves have amazing damage.
DC is also a high cycle DPS move though, and low IVs aren't very relevant - they were already irrelevant on offense prior to the rework and on defence, Dragonite with mediocre IVs still has higher max CP (or very close to, depending on distribution) than perfect IV Snorlaxes, the next highest max CP Pokemon that they were still worth powering.
If he has a charge TM then yeah, his level 34 DT/HB Dragonite is most likely the best candidate for it but we're talking about quick TMs. If he doesn't have anything else worth using a quick TM on (he said he only has the other Dragonite), he could use it on the Dragonite so that he has 2 for raiding.
Do you have any other Pokemon that could benefit from a quick move TM?
For example if I already had a level 34 Tyranitar but it had Iron Tail + Stone Edge or Crunch I would use a quick move TM on that instead of the Dragonite since it's already high level.
But if you don't have any other Pokemon worth using a TM on, and don't want to risk evolving a Dratini, you could TM and power up this instead and think of it as guaranteeing a good moveset - powering from level 8 to 30 is 108 candies, less than evolving a level 30 wild Dratini and you only need one TM that has a guaranteed outcome (using a quick TM on SW will result in DT 100%) while an evolved Dratini might end up with SW/HB which would need 2 TMs.
I have a DT/DC Dragonite and it's really good but it's not better than DB/DC or DT/O. DT/O does the most DPS and DB/DC is the most HP efficient. Don't take it the wrong way, DT/DC is still an amazing moveset but it's not the #1 in anything as far as I'm aware.
Thanks for the thoughts. Yeah, if DT/DC isn't better than DT/O then I might as well just work on evolving some more — maybe one that's a higher level to start with. And when I get a charge TM I can change that Hyperbeam Dragonite.
Here are other potential candidates for the fast TM. It's possible I have others that might be good attackers and I'm just not thinking of them.
Machamp:
- Bullet Punch / Stone Edge • 93.3% • 30 • 2449 CP
(would have to get a charge TM as well for this guy)
- Bullet Punch / Cross Chop • 73.3% • 29 • 2292 CP
Rhydon:
- Rock Smash / Earthquake • 91% • 35.5 • 3054 CP
Gyarados:
- Bite / Dragon Pulse • 93.3% • 35.5 • 3048 CP
- Bite / Hydropump • 93.3% • 35.5 • 3043 CP
Blissey:
- Zen Headbutt / Hyper Beam • 93.3% • 34.5 • 2939 CP
- Zen Headbutt / Psychic • 51.1% • 30 • 2479 CP
Tyranitar
- Iron Tail / Crunch • 95.6% • 28 • 2922 CP
- I was powering this guy up to be a hard-to-beat high-CP defender, but now that that doesn’t matter, maybe I just give him bite and make him an attacker?
Thanks!
Should probably mention that those are my only Blisseys, Gyaradoses and Tyranitar. (I have 460 Magikarp candies but am holding out for a shiny.)
I have 13 Machamps, including a 2342 & 1647-CP KC/CC; 2291, 2280, 2232 & 2223 C/DPs; and 2286, 2260 & 2115 C/CC. So it'd mainly be about trying to get the best one the best movset.
And I have a shit ton of Rhydons, natch, but that's my strongest.
Personally I'd say the Tyranitar would have priority for a quick TM. Tyranitars aren't that good as defenders anymore for several reasons - super effectiveness multiplier increased, max CP no longer relevant, gyms are easy to fully sweep with only 6 slots instead of 10.
Previously they were "good" because they'd hide behind Blisseys or Snorlax which would be the real deterrents to that gym being taken down.
The Tyranitar only needs a quick TM but the other candidates either need both moves rerolled or just aren't as viable anymore.
Machamp - BP/SE - needs 2 TMs for sure, while BP/Cross, Cross Chop is an underwhelming move because of it's low damage, but I wouldn't get rid of it because it's legacy and you might end up with Heavy Slam too.
Rhydon - with super effectiveness being buffed and STAB nerfed, Rock Smash is actually better against Snorlax and Tyranitar, probably the two most sought-after raid bosses.
Previously Mud Slap and Rock Smash were more or less identical vs these two, and although Mud Slap is better on defence, it's not a good defender anymore for the same reasons as Tyranitar.
Gyarados - B/HP is still a great moveset for offense, I wouldn't use a quick TM to get DT when the difference in effectiveness between the 2 quick moves is much smaller than on other Pokemon.
B/DP is legacy so I wouldn't get rid of DP, and I wouldn't use a quick TM to get a DT/DP Gyarados when DT/O and DT/HP are better and also currently available.
Blissey - great defenders regardless of moveset. The one with ZH/HB could be helpful in raids if it had P/HB instead but I think Tyranitar's better since dealing more damage in raids = extra premier balls to catch the boss with.
If you were looking for a defending Blissey then I'd say just stick to the current moves, they're good enough. Gyms are too easy to clear that DG won't make a significant difference.
In a tier 4 Raid, i managed to get two Charge TM. I had decent amount of candiles to get a other Dragonite.
I decide to use a TM in the Dragonite that in already had with Dragon Breath/Hyper Beam and get Outrage!
Now, this monster is a Dragon Breath/Outrage that make something good now in Gyms and Raids. Im very happy with that.
