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Machamp Legacy

Hello everyone,
I've a Machamp with karate Chop and cross chop and I would like to know if it worth to power up, why they rate it's moveset as C? Please give me some insights.
Thanks

Asked by MrCav8 years ago

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Answers

If you disagree with some of GP's ratings, just be it! I do. And that won't change how the mon actually performs in the game.
Regarding this KC/CChop Machamp, I have one at L30, ~2350CP. He can beat 2700CP Blissey by perfect dodging (KC and CChop are both very quick), so IMO is a good prestiger against Blissey. It's sort of like a DB/DC compared to DT/O (Counter/DP), though it's not a good comparison.
Damage-efficiency speaking, it's close to C/CCombat, but TBH noticeably lower than C/DP.
Conclusion: C/DP is still the best. But KC/CChop is quick and has advantage in dealing with Psychic Blissey and BS Snorlax compared to C/CCombat.

I'm not sure that is totally accurate. I will start by saying that cross chop is superior to DP when it comes to dodging, but when it comes to quick moves, counter and karate chop actually have the same cool down time. Dodging with the quick moves should be the same, if not easier with counter. Karate chop appears quicker than it is because 1 attack is actually 2 chops. The appearance of it being quicker can make dodging trickier when compared to counter. Because of that the Dragonite comparison isn't totally accurate. I would say a better comparison is something like solar beam compared to petal blizzard. PB is the better move for dodging, but SoB is superior in damage.

First of all, Counter is 0.9s CD, KC is 0.8s.
Second, between two Zen Headbutt (Common threats from Snorlax and Blissey), you can fit in two Counter or three KC. Taking this into consideration, KC is as damage-efficient as Counter when dodging quick moves (24 vs 24) but generates almost as double as much energy compared to Counter (30 vs 16). If only KC could pair with DP.
Third, the tolerance of error. One extra KC after Blissey uses Psychic still leaves you just enough time to dodge the Psychic, but one extra Counter doesn't. And that's what it takes for Blissey to KO your Machamp.

Think of it this way...kc/cc used to be his best moveset and is now a C in comparison to the new moveset. The reason for that is counter is just that much better, and DP is superior in every way. Against Blissey, the new movesets make Machamp the best counter, with the old one, I would call him viable. I rarely use my 2500 cp kc/cc Machamp. I use him against Snorlax, not Blissey. If you are looking for a Snorlax or Tyranitar counter, power him up. If you are looking for a Blissey counter, I wouldn't.

One more thing: DP has a 2.7s cooldown whereas Cross Chop has a 1.6s cooldown. With KC/CC, it is much more likely to be able to dodge ZHB and Psychic

Yah its still a double fighting machamp

I have a 2414 CP KC/CC Level 30 one. It's definitely usable and the best machamp for dodging.

However, its damage output is not particularly outstanding, and it will last shorter than other top tier mons, dragonite, trex, maybe even gyarados. You'll have to make the call. If you really don't have any better option to deal with blissey/snorlax, then go for it.

Sure.

Gamepress's ratings are based on dps (only), compared to other movesets the Pokémon has access to. I'm machamp's example, C/DP has a significant enough difference in cyclical dps compared to C/CC such that C/DP receives an "A" and C/CC receives a "B." There is also a significant enough difference between C/CC and KC/CC that KC/CC receives a "C".

Despite this, KC/CC has 3 "pros" or supporting reasons why I, if I was in your situation, would not hesitate to power it up:

It is Machamp's fastest moveset, in terms of cooldown. KC has a 0.1s cooldown difference from counter (I think) BUT CC is great because it has a 1.6s cooldown, which will allow machamp to whip it out and quickly dodge afterwards.
KC generates energy faster than counter and will allow for a fast generation for CC. This prove to be useful in PvP, where I predict it will be advantageous to have multi-bar, short cooldown charge moves (to allow Machamp to whip one out and retreat).
IT HAS TWO FIGHTING MOVES! So many users on here can attest to the misfortunate of machamp evolution outcomes. You could always evolve one and hope for the best (1/3 chance of getting a dual-fighting move machamp both now and pre-legacy). Machop candies do not seem to be easy to acquire for many apart from the random fortune of nests.

Gamepress move rankings are not based on DPS. They base them on battle simulations and testing. That is why it took so long for them to update them.

Didn't know that, thank you!

For the aforementioned argument I presented, I still believe this machamp has merit and should not be deemed as unviable

I wouldn't.
I have one and ever since I got a wrath with RS\DP I love the moveset (i have 6 machamps and none have that). I'd try and see if you can get your hands on either c/dp or c/cc on a machamp before you use candies on that.
You're not losing anything by keeping him, you can train with him.
IMO you would want something that takes something out quick, and a machamp with that moveset.