Is Psychic in fact Blissey's best charge move?
Hi trainers,
I am aware this question may sound odd at first, but please hear me out. I suppose most will agree that there are two general category of mons to take out Blissey in time, namely the very fast hard-hitters (e.g. Machamp, DB Dragonite, PsyCut Alakazam (until he faints)) and the slower heavy-weights (e.g. Exeggutor, Rhydon). Like probably many other trainers, I got less lucky on the very fast ones (especially the desired Machamp with double fight moves just seems to elude me) but do have several heavyweigths at my disposition. This means that quite often I end up fighting Blisseys with one of the heavyweights.
Now, I have fought against Blisseys with all movesets so far. I find that when attacking with my dragonite, I don't really care about Blissey's charge move because I usually manage to dodge either. However, with my slower heavyweights, I end up eating almost all psychic charge moves, while usually being able to dodge dg and of course hb.
So at this point in time it looks as if in real life battling I have suffered from Blissey's psychic charge move most. Maybe I will learn to better adjust my timing in the future, but I somehow doubt it because with Blissey I concentrate on the clock above all else.
What are your experiences from fighting Blissey in real life?
Answers
The spreadsheets I've looked at say zen headbutt is better (defensively, not offensively). Maybe the spreadsheets you were looking at were for attacking DPS?
Also, if you look at the moves on this site, you'll see that zen headbutt has more defensive DPS than pound. Adding to that it's SE against fighting types, zen headbutt wins in all counts.
Probably true if you don't try to dodge the quick moves and gives less room for error simply due to Psychic hitting faster (1.3 sec vs. 2.1 secs after charged attack notice).
Dazzling Gleam does comes out a lot, so if you are worried with timeouts, you will get hit by them since you rather not time out. It does tend to give you enough warning as long as you are not stuck in a charge move or very slow quick move.
I'm still hoping Psychic becomes a 2 bar move again.
Agree with the wish Psychic became a 2 bar move again.
About dodging quick attacks, don't know about you guys, but for me that is not really an option during most of the fight against a strong blissey. Just came back from a fight with my 2720 zh/sob exeggutor against a 2945 zh/hb blissey. Just to see where it would lead me, I started with a pattern of dishing out zh twice and then dodging or, if I received a zh before the dodge, dishing out another two and dodge then. About 35 seconds into the fight i realized i would surely time out going on like that, so for the rest of the fight i only dodged hb. I finished with about 16 seconds to spare and a red health bar. Kudos to everyone who performs against a comparable blissey with a 24xx exeggutor quite a bit faster and with a comfortable health reserve at the end of the fight to boot (such players seem to exist judging from this thread). I seem not to be sufficiently skilled for such a deed.
Only fought against HB and Psychic so far (highest CP about 2900). Of those two I see Psychic clearly as a greater threat since it is effective against my two C/DP Machamps. Additionally, HB is easy to dodge even if I just used DP. Never timed out by the way.
Is a Machamp with steel type attacks of any use against an ice/rock or fairy defender? E.g. C/HS Machamp against Tyrannitar? I couldn't try yet since there are no Tyrannitars in gyms around here. Got a BP/DP and a BP/CC too...
Dazzling Gleam Blisseys are extremely hard to prestige with, Psychic may be easier because the Blissey uses it less often. Can't think how people effeicent prestiging with DG Chanseys, it is ultra-extraordinarily hard to prestige with.
Hyper Beam is the Psychic that hits harder and slower, plus the STAB.
Bring an Umbreon (mostly not attacking, only taking damage) to be hit by Psychic, then switch back after it receives the attack. Though Ash Ketchum will kill you if he knows this thing.
I have only fought against 2930+ blissey (pound, psychic) with my 2495cp zen headbutt, solar beam exeggutor.
I have no problems so far, if i remember right i can even get hit by once and still win the fight with 20sec left in timer.
I have to try dodge psychic 3x in each fight.
Sometimes you get hit but if you focus you wont get.
I think other 2 moves are easier to dodge but i think dazzling gleam would be propably most akward fight, cus you maybe need to dodge more than 3x.
But have no experience.
I personally think pound + psychic is worst move set, but lets be honest, there isnt bad blissey.
I would be happy if my blissey gets headbutt + gleam or hyper.
My personal dream attacker vs blissey is Donphan.
With counter + earthquake or play rough.
I think donphan has good stats and no weakness vs any of blisseys attacks.
Also i think donphans dps could be enough.
But have no experience about this yet.
Psychic is underrated by being difficult for most player to dodge.
Stone Edge and HydroPump likewise are difficult.
Mathematically, it all comes down to the Opponents Dodge Chances.
HB 150*1.25 Stab does 187.5. When you dodge you take 25% Damage. So HB dodged does more like 46.875 damage. I tend to place the Dodge Chance of HB at 100%.
Psychic only does 100 damage. No Stab. However, if you fail to dodge Psyhic just 29% of the time. It does more damage than HB.
If you think Opposing Players get hit by Psychic more than 29% of the time. Psychic > HyperBeam
((Technically it would be slightly lower than 29% since 2.8 Psychic would then get in 1/2 of a quick move vs 3.8 hyperbeam or could be slightly higher if you figure the attacker is playing it extra safe on Hyperbeam dodging and missing squeezing in an extra quick attack. So for mental ease, I just tend to think of it if you Psychic lands for full 1 out of 3 times > Hyperbeam)
There's a similiar break even point on Dazzling Gleam as well. It's just harder becuase I wouldn't say the Dodge Rate on any 2 bar move is 100%.
Dodge Difficulty is something people should calculate in as a percentage chance when comparing movesets.
Yeah, i think psychic propably do more dmg than hyper beam in long run.
There are still sooo many snorlaxes with hyper beams and i dont even remember when i got hit by them.
Its been so long time.
But alrdy got hit by psychics of the blissey, even i havent fight this blissey many times.
But i think hyper beam might sometimes eat more seconds from the clock, i personally stop attacking immediatly when i know beam is coming and i always feel it last forever to wait flash.
Psychic gives me way more trouble than Hyper Beam. I can't understand how Gamepress considers HB a "B" defensive move, and Psychic a "D." I never, ever get hit by a HB from Blissey, which makes attacking it very predictable and easy. Psychics often come with little warning, and occasionally I miss one.
I have at least as much trouble with DG, though, because it can come at unpredictable intervals,
hyperbeam is only any good as a delay on a really high level blissey IMO - very easy to spot and dodge but it usually does dmg even if dodged, makes players spam dodge till it's over and if you screw up the dodge or get lag you've either got a dead attacker or (worse) that switching bug where you go to next attacking 'mon then back to original 'mon but can't attack while timer still counts down.
DG is very hard to dodge and has good counters so i'd say that's the best in a perfect world, but with bugs, lag, chip dmg and it's potential to either slow (while dodging) or nuke an attacker i think hyperbeam is best for very high level blisseys going for timeout.
edit - few psychic blisseys in my area but i was just fighting one earlier, it is a bit tricky to anticipate and dodge in first fight but very predictable after that and does surprisingly little damage. i stick with DG being the best defence move as it's hard to predict, very hard to dodge and often is cast back to back unexpectedly but HB is second IMO as not dodging is usually fatal and it disrupts offence more.
