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Why Confusion over Zen Headbutt as a defender move?

Your analysis tends to place Confusion above Zen Headbutt for defenders. According to Trainer Tips calculations (linked at the end of this), Confusion / Psychic and ZH / Psychic have almost identical damage output (6.05 vs 6.00 defender DPS.) But since ZH hits more often, it forces the attacker to dodge more, and it's more likely to hit undodged after charge attacks.

Is there something I'm missing here?

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Hd8OBzTWDxk9cn6_tE7rXm6VngzpkpoYhqMeVJeR7Ds/edit#gid=0

Asked by Arguer8 years 3 months ago
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Answers

Confusion is 15 per hit and Zen Headbutt is 12, so they have different Defensive DPS.
https://pokemongo.gamepress.gg/pokemon-move/confusion
https://pokemongo.gamepress.gg/pokemon-move/zen-headbutt

This may be of use to you:
https://www.reddit.com/r/TheSilphRoad/comments/51magh/dps_weave_damage_and_move_sets_explained_a/

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You're missing that in defense pokemon hit at a certain time, no matter what the move is. So stronger move------->usually worse attacking move and best defensive move

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This isn't true. 1.5 - 2.5 seconds gets added to the cooldown, but the cooldown will still be different. The difference isn't as significant after that addition, but it still exists. If all moves had same cooldown on defence, there would be no Bubble strat.

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by kkmmdd 8 years 3 months ago

You're just not reading the spreadsheet right. For some reason the column after Fast Attack is Type, not Charge Attack. There was probably some....Confusion (puts on sunglasses) since Exeggutor is Psychic type, which is also a possible Charge Attack.

Actual Defensive DPS for ZH/Psychic is 5.45 . The Defensive DPS for ZH/SB is the one that's listed as 6.00 .

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Ah thanks, this is it. So ZH/P does 90% of the DPS of C/P. Though even with this difference, I'm still sceptical of Confusion being better, given the advantages that noticeably shorter cooldown of ZH has.

(Just for the other folks that answered, different moves don't have same cooldowns on defence. The same amount gets added, but the cooldowns still remain different. The difference isn't as significant as on offence, but it still exists)

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by pipjay 8 years 3 months ago

I've heard other people expressing similar ideas about favoring Zen Headbutt on defenders to make it more difficult for fighting.

From my experience, when using an Arcanine with high CP to attack an Exeggutor in an enemy gym, there is not much difference between Zen Headbutt and Confusion. When dodging most attacks and missing a few dodges to use a charge move, I take about the same amount of damage over the course of the fight no matter what moveset the defending Exeggutor has.

On the other hand, when using a Parasect with half CP to train against an Exeggutor in a friendly gym, there is a big difference between Zen Headbutt and Confusion. With Bug Bite/X-Scissor or Fury Cutter/X-Scissor, I can make every dodge against a Confusion moveset and end with about 20-30% of Parasect's HP remaining. X-Scissor fits perfectly in between the dodges against Confusion and any of the charge moves. Not against Zen Headbutt though. When training against Zen Headbutt, I either take a lot of damage when using X-Scissor, or I only use X-Scissor after charge moves. Either way I can't deal enough damage fast enough to keep up with the Exeggutor's damage so I end up needing to use about one and a half Parasects against Zen Headbutt.

So since there is little difference for enemy players, but a big difference for teammates, I prefer using Exeggutors with Confusion for defense.

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